Falcons Moving Toward Trade To Ship Chris Houston To Detroit Lions
by Dave Choate on Mar 8, 2010 8:00 AM EST
in Falcons News
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PrintChris Houston was supposed to be the answer at cornerback for the Atlanta Falcons. It's funny, in a way, that Houston came in part to supplant giant disappointment Jimmy Williams, and he'll be leaving with many seeing him as a disappointment in his own right.
The busy Adam Schefter reported yesterday that Houston is headed to the Detroit Lions, with the Falcons getting the second pick in the sixth round and swapping up 17 spots in the fifth round. It's probably the best haul the Falcons could reasonably be expected to get for the corner, whose talent was greater than his production over the course of the last three seasons in Atlanta. But is trading him the right move?
The answer is obviously going to depend on where you're coming from with the great Chris Houston debate, but it's clear that it was the right move for management. They believe Dunta Robinson is better than Chris Houston, but they're similar enough cornerbacks that it wouldn't make a lot of sense to keep both around. Chris Owens or Brent Grimes are going to be the starter opposite Robinson, and that had been clear for a long time. Either is a better fit as a ballhawking nickel cornerback than Houston, who has only picked three passes in three seasons.
It also gives the Falcons better draft position in the fifth round and an additional pick in the sixth round. Over Thomas Dimitroff's tenure, he's hit on Kroy Biermann and arguably Garrett Reynolds in the fifth and whiffed on Robert James and William Middleton. In the sixth round, he's gotten the Falcons Thomas Brown and Spencer Adkins. Biermann was obviously a fantastic pick, but the rest either haven't panned out or just haven't gotten enough playing time yet. It's not exactly the place where dreams are usually made, but Dimitroff likes to have extra picks to play with, and Houston's recent spate of injuries and ineffectiveness made this the best haul the Falcons could get.
And me? I think Chris Houston got a terrible rap in Atlanta—I was waving that banner for a long time myself—and it's a shame that he should be kicked to the curb for so little. The NFL is a game of production first and foremost, and while he was a little better than average in coverage in 2009, he really never had a head for where the ball was going to be and he had that infuriating habit of never looking back for it, either. He was, in many ways, an average cornerback in the body of a man who could be a great one. I suspect he always will be.
So at the end of the day, this was jettisoning a man who was never as good as he was supposed to be, to make way for a plethora of young cornerbacks the new administration has brought on board themselves and to allow the team to properly showcase their new prize, Dunta Robinson. By getting rid of Houston, the team is gambling that he'll never put it together the way he ought to have, and they're gambling the movement of draft picks will help the team. It's another gamble from Dimitroff, but one that we have to trust will work. The alternative isn't so great.
Your thoughts?
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I like it. Houston was never appreciated in ATL.
And at the end of the day, he wasn’t a guy associated with this coach/GM combo. He had some bad habits, but I always thought he was good. I am no draft guru, but from what I hear, this is a deep one. Key to the draft is always to get as many picks as possible because it’s a crapshoot. Glad we got something decent for him.
Just heard Comrade
Pretty sure he’s gonna be president of the world.btw he said trade talks aren’t for sure.
Rule #1: Double tap.
by Ball Hawk on Mar 8, 2010 8:38 AM EST via mobile reply actions
I say good move
He was not maturing at all as a player. He showed the same problems in coverage that he had displayed since he was drafted. His refusal to simply turn and look for the ball made him a liability on fly patterns, which we have regularly seen him get absolutely abused on. Such a glaring weakness which he showed no signs of fixing would certainly continue to be exploited. This was the right move, not only due to the glut of more productive talent at corner, but due to his own deficiencies on the field.
Let us remember Chris Houston for this moment:
This is an easy call. We have 149 young cornerbacks, and all have shown signs of growth except Houston. He’ll have a chance to shine — over at the Lions blog, they’re all convinced he’ll immediately start.
Hope this works out well for everyone.
Longest Atlanta Falcons winning-seasons streak: 2008 - current
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I think YOU could immediately start for them
"Statistics are like bikinis. What they reveal is suggestive, but what they conceal is vital." - Aaron Levenstein
Houston may not have shown growth
but even without that growth he was still better than all the young ’uns we have backing up
go hard or go home
Speaking of bloggers
Did anyone pay a visit to the Texans blog after we signed Robinson? They sounded pretty apathetic…maybe even giddy about losing Robinson. It’s like a parallel universe
It's already been said, but...
Houston was very athletic. He was often in great position to make a play, but he never looked for the ball in the air.
I want a defense that hits hard and creates turnovers (even if they give up yards). I think we’re moving in that direction.
Roddy White to Tony Gonzalez: "we may trade chris Houston so we improving the D"
http://twitter.com/roddywhiteTV/status/10152378227
Longest Atlanta Falcons winning-seasons streak: 2008 - current
The Falcoholic · Blog · Twitter
Ouch, Roddy.
Let’s hope the deal doesn’t fall through – those two (White and Houston) won’t be pals anymore.
I like this move. The more picks in the draft the better. CH was not getting it done and with the acquisition of Dunta, the emergence of Grimes (I really like him) and Williams being resigned it only made sense that if you could get something for a #4 cornerback you do it. I agree that Grimes is probably better suited as a Nickel, ballhawk zone type of player but I think you have to give that man a chance. Either way I am super pumped, I’m loving the moves the birds are making.
by Michael J. Bermudez on Mar 8, 2010 9:27 AM EST reply actions
Seems like the argument is value...
But potential doesn’t equal value. Results do. We got what we could get for him, considering he might’ve not been a productive guy for us coming off the bench because he thinks he should be a starter. I see Williams starting over Owens/Jackson/Grimes for one more year…
"If lessons were learned in defeat, our team is getting a great education." -Murray Warmath
IMO
I don’t think Williams will be 100% at the start of the year and will have to be backup to Owens. I think they signed him for insurance. They weren’t sure if they were going to land Robinson. If they didn’t they wouldn’t have been any worse than last year. Since they did, it seems they feel that they have improved at the position—-and I agree.
absolutely not
Williams was horrible last year. Owens did awesome (in limited opportunities) in coverage, and Grimsey held receivers to the lowest yards per completion against out of anyone in our CB corps, why would those two sit behind Williams?
Unless Hill gets cut, Williams won’t even break camp with the Birds.
Founder and Proud Member of the JASON SNELLING AIN'T ALL THAT AND A BAG O' CHIPS ASSOCIATION OF AMERICA
That's interesting.
It seems like it’s 50/50 on how Williams played last year. Some of us thinks he did really well while others think he was awful. I’m one that thought he did well. Out of curiousity, what is it that you saw that made you think otherwise? No debate just want to know your thoughts.
Posted this elsewhere ... but here goes:
YPC = Yards Per Completion (total yards gained by the receivers you guarded divided by the number of times you were targeted and the receiver actually caught the ball)
CA% = Completion Against Percentage (number of times you were targeted and the receiver actually caught the ball divided by the number of times you were targeted)
with both CA% and YPC, the lower the better
Grimes
YPC: 11.8
CA%: 62.4 (58/93)
Owens – sample size ALERT!
YPC: 17.2
CA%: 56 (14/25)
Jackson – sample size ALERT!
YPC: 9
CA%: 72.7 (24/33)
Williams – sample size ALERT!
YPC: 13.8
CA%: 75.9 (22/29)
Hill – sample size ALERT!
YPC: 17.3
CA%: 90.9 (10/11)
Houston
YPC: 12
CA%: 66.7 (42/63)
Robinson
YPC: 11
CA%: 65.9 (54/82)
Now these numbers don’t address his ability against the run. But clearly Grimes did a lot better (with a lot more reps to his credit in ’09) and Owens/Jackson showed a lot of promise (despite Chris giving up a few bombs and both their limited reps).
I just don’t see how you’d justify starting Williams over any of Owens/Jackson/Grimes, unless any of Owens/Jackson/Grimes are worse against then run, and then you’d only have a justification for playing him before any of those on running downs.
But is he better than any of those three against the run? I can’t really say for sure to be honest. PFF had his run defense value at -3 in ’09 (bad games vs. the run against SF and Chi), -.2 in ’08 (two good games vs. the run and two bad games vs. the run), and -1.6 in ’07 (two bad games vs. the run).
How does that compare with Grimes/Owens/Jackson?
Grimes
1.1 in ’07 (one good game vs. the run – his only good game)
.4 in ’08 (two good games vs. the run and one bad game vs. the run)
.1 in ’09 (no particularly bad or good games)
Owens
2.1 in ’09 (six games, but no particularly bad or good games)
Jackson
-1.5 in ’09 (one pretty bad game)
-3 in ’08 (one particularly bad game)
So yeah. Take those run defense values for what they are.
At the end of the day, Grimes and Owens need to start before Williams. In my opinion, you could make a case for replacing Jackson with Williams on run downs, but I really do feel like Jackson is better than Williams (at this point in his career) in coverage).
So how do I rank ’em?
Dunta
Grimes
Owens
Jackson
Williams
Hill (no justification needed there)
Founder and Proud Member of the JASON SNELLING AIN'T ALL THAT AND A BAG O' CHIPS ASSOCIATION OF AMERICA
couldn't agree more
with either owens or grimes starting. personally i would prefer grimes to start the season and go from there.
good breakdown
He’s always open. He catches a lot of balls. He’s un-guardable, no matter how old he is
my thoughts?
Houston is worth more than a jump of 17 spots in the 5th round! And 6th round? For real? Bunch of junk laying around.
by nathan rothschild on Mar 8, 2010 9:52 AM EST reply actions
Tom Brady.
Longest Atlanta Falcons winning-seasons streak: 2008 - current
The Falcoholic · Blog · Twitter
Biermann was a sixth-rounder
Jason Snelling was a seventh. It’s far from an exact science, but the more picks you have late in the draft, the better your shot of landing a young, talented, cheap player for a few years. That’s the way Dimitroff likes ’em.
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Fifth-rounder....
Damnit.
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Shannon Sharpe
Longest Atlanta Falcons winning-seasons streak: 2008 - current
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Deacon Jones
Roger Staubach
Longest Atlanta Falcons winning-seasons streak: 2008 - current
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Michael Turner.
Aaron Kampman, Robert Mathis, Trent Cole.
Jay Ratliff.
Longest Atlanta Falcons winning-seasons streak: 2008 - current
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I think ya'll have jumped
to a conclusion… that im against this trade. And yes, over the years there are some solid players that come out of every round. Tom Brady is the exception. Once in 50 years does the best Qb in the league come from the mid 7th round.
Colston comes at a position that can succeed (and you can argue his ability as well coming from playing with Brees) and defensive players and role players flourish in this round. But most players don’t make the roster… plain and simple.
I dislike Houston very much. I want him gone so he doesn’t sacrifice the roster spot of a younger kid.
I am in favor of even cutting Houston if he can’t go elsewhere in a trade.
But yes brickcheney I agree after all of your research you prove that valuable players do come from the late rounds. Eureka!
" No, I think I'll sit in the balcony " - Abe Lincoln
I see what you're saying
It’s not a great haul, but it’s probably reasonably the best haul we could get for Houston.
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Best QB could be up for debate.
Won’t start, but I’ll respectfully disagree.
"Ryan, under center. Single receiver set, time on his side. Ryan, gonna throw. First professional pass.....CAUGHT!! Jenkins! 30! 25! 20! 15! 10! 5! He lives in Atlanta!!!" -Wes Durham
Peyton is numero uno now
but while Brady was winning all those SBs he was THE GUY.
" No, I think I'll sit in the balcony " - Abe Lincoln
I wouldn't mind holding on to Houston, but...
I think the picks are reasonable. When the Ravens get Boldin for picks toward the end of the 3rd and 4th, and Houston is a guy who could have been outright cut, the top of the 5th and 6th isn’t bad.
by widderslainte on Mar 8, 2010 11:39 AM EST up reply actions
Like I said in the other thread, I don’t like these moves, but I understand why they were done. Once Dunta was signed, this was probably inevitable. Good luck, Chris…
As for the picks, the only good I see is that it is a little bit more ammo for Dimitroff to move up in the 3rd if somebody they like slips a bit. I don’t expect anybody selected in the 5th or 6th Round to be a serious contributor.
"Statistics are like bikinis. What they reveal is suggestive, but what they conceal is vital." - Aaron Levenstein
I think we
can find a good OG in the 5th and 6th rounds. We drafted Walker in the 7th last year and he is a very good DT pick up. I expect him to get much more playing time this year. There is talent in those rounds, especially from small schools. I just hope TD can continue to find it.
I'm extremely pleased
with the move. I’ve pulled for Houston since he’s been here. And like many of you said, he would always be right there but he never seemed to quite get it. He didn’t play his game. He is a bump and run CB that rarely challenged any receiver off the line of scrimmage.
the grass is always greener...
i’m surprised at how much negativity i’m seeing on this site over our CB moves (not so much on this thread as the others, but this is the most recent one so i’m posting here).
for those who don’t like the Dunta Robinson move, my question would be “what do you think Dimitroff should have done?” if you’re gonna say “draft another one”, i think that’s a terrible idea. draft busts at the CB position are a dime a dozen (we already have one on our team named Tye Hill), and even if you get one and he does pan out, it’s probably gonna take awhile for him to mature. there is only one CB in this draft that everyone thinks is a top tier player (Haden), and he’s not gonna be available at #19. If you trade up to get him, now you’re left with multiple holes on your defense that you have to address using 3rd round picks or higher. so let’s please stop these “we should have drafted a corner” arguments. we did that last year with Chris Owens, i think we’re happy with him, so let’s not keep spending a draft pick every year on the same position.
that leaves free agency, which makes way more sense. your GM just went out and got the top rated CB in this year’s free agent class. is he a shut down #1 corner? there are reasons to think he will be and reasons to think he won’t, but that’s not the point – he doesn’t have to be! we simply need some degree of stability at the position, which we didn’t have before. Dunta is experienced and competent… he’s the type of player we needed in a secondary corp filled with rookies and aging veterans.
concerning Houston, where did all the “Houston love” suddenly come from? I saw nothing but disdain for this guy all over this website throughout the 2010 season. when he got hurt i thought most people were thankful… now i’m seeing people sad that he’s leaving?? what production did the guy give that makes this a huge loss.
i think we have a tendency to take a “grass is always greener” mentality during the offseason… we get nervous about the moves our front office makes because “oh my gosh!!! what if it doesn’t work???”, so we think not doing the move or doing something else would have been better than what we did. but in the situation of our CB’s, there wasn’t a better move to be made, unless you want to deal with fantasy, “what if” scenarios (i.e., trade our entire team for Revis, get this guy in the 6th round who we KNOW is gonna be awesome, etc.).
so let’s cut out front office a little slack here. Dimitroff does a great job evaluating talent, especially in the secondary (i’m already impressed by Owens), so perhaps he knows what he’s doing.
by cheshire falcon on Mar 8, 2010 10:42 AM EST reply actions 12 recs
Rec'd
Almost all of the “Houston love” that I’ve seen is coming from me and FrankyWren, and I know I’ve been defending Houston all year.
And even though I disagree with these 2 moves, your reasoning is sound, so I decided to help turn your comment green. I hope Dimitroff (and you) are right.
"Statistics are like bikinis. What they reveal is suggestive, but what they conceal is vital." - Aaron Levenstein
thanks man...
and understand, i’m not one of the “let’s just blindly trust our GM because he did a good job getting Matt Ryan” people. I mean i think it’s fine to criticize your front office regardless of their track record (as long as it’s kept in perspective that they know things we don’t know) – i think that’s part of what makes being a fan so much fun, and why blogs like this are fun. and I even understand why people might be a little critical of these moves.
i just think relative to the circumstances, who was available, what our overall team needs are, etc., these are solid moves… not necessarily ideal, (although they could end up that way), but solid. We need the overall team to get better, and I think Dimitroff is doing that. That’s why I love this new ownership.
by cheshire falcon on Mar 8, 2010 12:34 PM EST up reply actions
which is far
but what is the harming in talking through it? Looking at the positive and negatives and letting people express their opinions. I rec’d your initial comment as well bee tee dub.
Founder and Proud Member of the JASON SNELLING AIN'T ALL THAT AND A BAG O' CHIPS ASSOCIATION OF AMERICA
far = fair
Founder and Proud Member of the JASON SNELLING AIN'T ALL THAT AND A BAG O' CHIPS ASSOCIATION OF AMERICA
well ...
as someone who has expressed much negativity re: both the Dunta and Houston moves, I think some (not all) are a little too hasty to defend the fort around here.
Trust me, I want nothing but success for the Birds, but it’s the off-season, and how interesting would these boards really be (i.e., how deep would we really dig if there weren’t dissent?) if there weren’t differing opinions?
In the end, we all want the same thing (The Lombardi Trophy in Atlanta), so don’t take any of my unreasoned, subjective rants too personally …
Founder and Proud Member of the JASON SNELLING AIN'T ALL THAT AND A BAG O' CHIPS ASSOCIATION OF AMERICA
Isn't that why these boards exist?
or at least one of the reasons to see different viewpoints?
by brotherbrown on Mar 8, 2010 11:52 PM EST up reply actions
Great comment...
I also like what you said about “i’m not one of the "let’s just blindly trust our GM because he did a good job getting Matt Ryan" people.” Kudos.
Less jettisoning and kicking to the curb than giving him an opportunity elsewhere. DET wants him, so get some compensation rather than summarily cutting him. At best, he’d be in the 4-deep mix for one starting spot. Would you really want Houston at a quick-response spot like the slot? Yes, he had that one pick-six, but he’s not quick to diagnose.
I’m happy for Houston that he’ll have another shot, and for ATL that we won’t have to grimace every tiime the Steve Smith catch commerical comes on w/ Houston hopelessly beat.
that commercial had fallacies.
in it, the falcons were wearing red, and in the background you could see they were the home team and something about Matt Ryan was mentioned.
But since matt ryan, the Falcons have not worn RED in the Georgia Dome against the Panthers, so the commercial was made up.
by brotherbrown on Mar 8, 2010 11:55 PM EST up reply actions
Houston to Lions
NFL.com reports the Falcons will receive Detroit’s fourth round pick (not sixth as reported by Adam Schefter) and swap fifth round picks for Chris Houston.
If that’s the case, it makes the trade much more amenable.
However, Detroit still needs D-line help (they are going to draft Okung not Suh as most pundits predict).
Add Jamaal Anderson to the mix and trade him and Houston for Detroit’s second round pick. Detroit gets two starters for one draft pick and we get back into the second round where we can draft Anderson’s replacement, Lamarr Houston who played DT and DE at Texas. He also has the speed to drop back in coverage.
Keith Brooking all but assures us a comp 2nd round pick....
Best thing he’s done for us in the past 5 years…
"If lessons were learned in defeat, our team is getting a great education." -Murray Warmath
Compensatory picks don’t start until the end of the 3rd round. And I seriously doubt Brooking will fetch us one that high (Foxworth might be worth a 3rd, though).
"Statistics are like bikinis. What they reveal is suggestive, but what they conceal is vital." - Aaron Levenstein
Didn't he start,,,
"If lessons were learned in defeat, our team is getting a great education." -Murray Warmath
As far as I know, yes. But if I understand Comp picks right, it’s more about their contract (then they factor playing time, etc), and the Boys signed him for dirt.
"Statistics are like bikinis. What they reveal is suggestive, but what they conceal is vital." - Aaron Levenstein
4th round pick???
that would be amazing!
what do you guys think the odds of us picking up a 2nd round pick are? i’m not that familiar with the packaging of things, so what would we have to give up to get one?
by cheshire falcon on Mar 8, 2010 12:35 PM EST up reply actions
Depends on what you're talking about as far as "picking up a 2nd"
For us to move from our 3rd Round pick (#83) to the say the same area of the 2nd Round (#52-ish) would probably take next year’s 2nd Rounder as the kicker, maybe more.
52 – worth 380 “points” on the old Daft Value Chart.
2011 2nd Rounder – figure it being worth about 190 points, as future picks are usually valued about half of what current year’s picks are worth.
83 (our Rnd3) – worth 175 points.
114 (our Rnd4) – worth 66 points (not near enough to get anything done).
Even the last pick in the 2nd Round (#64) is worth 270 points, so it would take our current Round 3, Round 4, plus more…
Bottom line, don’t count on getting into the 2nd Round. Compensatory picks cannot be traded, by the way.
"Statistics are like bikinis. What they reveal is suggestive, but what they conceal is vital." - Aaron Levenstein
about time
Chris Houston sucks…he brings shame to the name ‘Chris’…the kid couldnt cover a chocolate cake with icing if u gave it to him & couldnt be physical if his career depended on it…
by Dirtybyrdatl4life on Mar 8, 2010 12:06 PM EST via mobile reply actions
Up in the air
I do like the fact the falcons have reached an agreement and signed Robinson. I think They tendered a him a rather lofty contract though. Houston on the other hand, will be traded for essentially nothing. Moving up 17 spots and an extra 6th round pick? really? Is that all they could get? The Falcons could select someone of merit and value in that position providing they choose wisely. But the bottom line is very rarely does anyone that late make a severe impact.
Houston couldn’t provide aid at the corner position for the Falcons, that’s a fact. Just disappointed that’s all we could get for him.
Detroit: "We’ll swap positions with you in the 5th round and give you are 6th round pick. "
Atlanta: “That’s it?”
Detroit: “Well we’ll throw in a box of crackerjacks.”
Atlanta: “Deal!”
"And their 1st pick in the 2010 NFL draft...The Atlanta Falcons select Donavan Warren CB University of Michigan
I think they only threw in the prize from the box of crackerjacks
Founder and Proud Member of the JASON SNELLING AIN'T ALL THAT AND A BAG O' CHIPS ASSOCIATION OF AMERICA
Nice, just traded a 2nd round pick for a 6th rounder
McCay was a genius that draft…1st round, picked a DE who can’t sack and 2nd round, picked a Corner that can’t cover.
if you are talking about the 2007 draft
I just looked at our selections, and wow. The only good ones where the compensatory selections Stephen Nicholas, and Jason Snelling (our last pick)
by brotherbrown on Mar 9, 2010 12:11 AM EST up reply actions
That’s like saying, TD failed last year in the draft b/c our first and second rounders didn’t put in any time b/c they are injury prone. Its easy to look back and second guess… But the truth is we’re getting some value in return for Mr Pass Interference. As for JA, well … I don’t know but he gets another year as its looking right now to try and prove something.
JA
Doesn’t deserve another shot. He’s proven nothing to me as well as anyone else for that matter. trade him for more picks this year as well. I wouldn’t mind seeing him dealt for a 5th rounder and two hamburger flippers.
"And their 1st pick in the 2010 NFL draft...The Atlanta Falcons select Sean Weatherspoon, LB Missouri."
The difference that I see
between JA98 and Houston is that JA98 was playing out of position. We reached a couple of years ago to fill a void left by Kerney leaving and ended up with a DT. JA98 screams DT. Plus he didn’t do all that bad when he was playing in the middle and we need someone that knows the system while Babs is on a 4 game suspension. I think they will move him to the inside for good with Babs, Jerry, Walker, and Johnson/Lewis/or some other DT
I guess
Essentially JA will still be viewed as a backup. He wont be starting behind Babs or Jerry. Its just a shame when a 1st round top 10 pick can’t start any position on the Defensive line.
"And their 1st pick in the 2010 NFL draft...The Atlanta Falcons select Sean Weatherspoon, LB Missouri."
Ain't that right, Ryan Leaf
"Ryan, under center. Single receiver set, time on his side. Ryan, gonna throw. First professional pass.....CAUGHT!! Jenkins! 30! 25! 20! 15! 10! 5! He lives in Atlanta!!!" -Wes Durham
i think it comes down
to Dunta has shown that he can be a “shutdown” corner(2007). Will he return to that form? Let’s hope so but at least he’s shown he can. CH has done nothing, that i’ve seen, to show he can compete with NFL #1 WR.
I like the trade
…but I was just playing madden and blitzed houston against the panthers hit delhomme as he was throwing, steve smith made the catch and houston ran him down to keep him from scoring. if only he could play like this irl lol
Here's a link about the deal
I liked Houston and I think he should be worth more but it was a numbers game.
Hill, Grimes, Williams, Dunta, Chevious, Houston – someone had to go
http://jmike.blogs.atlantafalcons.com/2010/03/08/official-houston-traded-to-lions/
He’s always open. He catches a lot of balls. He’s un-guardable, no matter how old he is
Hopefully Falcons find value in these CBs from the 2010 Draft….
3rd Round Franks, Robinson
3rd/4th Round Donovan Warren, Priest, Spievey, Murphy
5th Round Arenas, Jefferson(both 4th rounders as kick off returners)
6th Round Lewis(more a S than CB)
Ideally we have Warren, Murphy or Spievey dropping to us in the 4th and Priest in the 5th. I believe our 3rd round pick will go to best available player regardless if offensive/defense. A solid TD/WR would be a position I would covet.
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